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Update definition for single pointer #3536
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The definition for "single pointer" has had issues for a long time, as it mixes the idea of what is a pointer with the action(s) *performed* using a pointer. See #749 (comment) and the recent #3535 where this is once again causing a non-sequitur
Not sure the new definition catches everything, such as joysticks, light pens or 'simulated' versions of pointer (think Dragon's mousegrid feature) for example. Will try to come up with a catch-all. |
@benja11y it doesn't need to be comprehensive ... I rejigged it so it doesn't give the impression that it's an exhaustive list |
Changed my - to a + |
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Looks good to me.
On deck for 1/23 call. |
From the call 1/12, in no particular order.
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@alastc @mbgower @bruce-usab et al ... updated the definition to incorporate some of the suggestions/feedback from yesterday's WCAG 2.x backlog meeting |
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Very clean edit, thanks!
We had significant discussion 1/19 call, but wording was not finalized. My few notes:
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As a possible alternative, I've moved the mention of multipoint (rather than "multi-pointer/multi-touch") into a note (following precedent set in other definitions that also include a note and/or example). |
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Looks fine to me, but is normative change, so will want to highlight that for AG review.
Single point on the screen/page could be interpreted by some as single pixel (x,y) point - is this always the case? |
what situations are you thinking of where this is not the case? |
A single point on a screen can be made up of several pixels, such as in the case of a retina display. Hence, it's helpful to not say specifically a pixel, but rather a point. The only case I can reasonably think of where it's not an x,y point (but not necessarily a single pixel) is in a 3D display system where it might be an x,y,z point. But I think this updated definition still covers current 3d technologies, where an x,y,z point is still delivered through a screen. |
@iadawn this went through CFC, so needs adding as an errata. (That's been a Staff task so far, I'm not sure where it is edited?) We'll keep it on the project board until that's confirmed. |
hurrah! |
@WilcoFiers added on list:
Could someone respond? (Here or on list.) |
I don't see how, to be honest. The new definition disentangles the fact that the term defined was the input (as in the mechanism), not the gesture (tap, swipe, etc) itself, because the previous definition was what was causing the non-sequitur in #3535 a path-based gesture can still be reliant on a single-pointer input (the mechanism of input, i.e. the finger, the mouse, the stylus), and nothing in the new definition contradicts that - unless you interpreted "input" as being the gesture rather than the mechanism (but under that interpretation, we had that contradiction of #3535). and the pointer events spec itself defines input as the mechanism too. |
Discussed this with @WilcoFiers; the confusion seems to be coming from the use of the term "at a time" in the new definition. Wilco suggested that an extra note/examples clarifying which actions a single pointer can perform would have helped clarified; perhaps we can reconsider adding something like this? <p class="example">Clicking, double-clicking, long-pressing, and dragging a slider are operations that can be performed using a single pointer.</p> |
Hi Dan, we had previous iterations (and #809) that included interactions such as clicking, but it moved the focus to the interactions rather than the input type, which seemed to cause more confusion. I'd also note we previously added a paragraph to the pointer-gestures understanding doc:
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Discussed 9/13, TF members affirmed okay as it. Patrick offers to do another close review, by 9/17 AG call. |
So this PR has already been merged - making tweaks to it would need a separate new PR. Before proceeding with that, and seeing @alastc's comment above #3536 (comment) about not adding in an extra note giving examples of gestures that can be performed with a single pointer, I'm wondering if changing just the start of this from
to
(adding the word "mechanism" after input, to make it clear that this is explicitly what this is referring to, rather than "input" in the sense of the "gesture") would help clarify things. |
Made the small PR just adding "mechanism" here #4070 @bruce-usab @alastc |
Reviewed and finalized on Sep 20 TF call with revisions to https://github.com/w3c/wcag/pull/4070/files. |
…ointer interactions (#4070) Follow-up to #3536 (comment) to potentially address concerns by @WilcoFiers @dbjorge Tries to more clearly differentiate "input" as in the *modality* from the gestures/interactions that are the *result* of using a particular input *modality* <!-- This comment and the below content is programmatically generated. You may add a comma-separated list of anchors you'd like a direct link to below (e.g. #idl-serializers, #idl-sequence): Don't remove this comment or modify anything below this line. If you don't want a preview generated for this pull request, just replace the whole of this comment's content by "no preview" and remove what's below. --> *** <a href="https://pr-preview.s3.amazonaws.com/w3c/wcag/pull/4070.html" title="Last updated on Sep 20, 2024, 8:10 PM UTC (a79bb49)">Preview</a> | <a href="https://pr-preview.s3.amazonaws.com/w3c/wcag/4070/4213bf6...a79bb49.html" title="Last updated on Sep 20, 2024, 8:10 PM UTC (a79bb49)">Diff</a> --------- Co-authored-by: Alastair Campbell <[email protected]> Co-authored-by: Mike Gower <[email protected]>
The definition for "single pointer" has had issues for a long time, as it mixes the idea of what a pointer is with the action(s) performed using a pointer.
I originally tried to fix this, but there was no appetite for it once 2.1 was released. However, with 2.2 and the new 2.5.7 Dragging Movement SC, the broken definition is causing actual misunderstandings/illogical non-sequiturs.
See #749 (comment) and the recent #3535 where this is once again causing a non-sequitur
Closes #3535
(this is effectively a follow-up to #809 which had disambiguated things, but the definition had since been changed further/again to reintroduce the ambiguous wording we have at this point which confuses input with action)
This would be applied to WCAG 2.1 and 2.2, unless there is a decision to only apply it to 2.2.
EDIT: Also closes #394
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