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Define measurements to be made and reported results from the Photometry Service #30
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@talister I'm not sure what centroiding uncertainty is for the output in forced photometry mode. Is this something like the distance between the peak pixel within a certain radius and the target coordinates (e.g., assuming there's a low S/N source close to the target coordinates)? If so, this would be different from my normal understanding of forced photometry, which is to simply measure the flux within a certain aperture at an exact position, in which case the "centroiding uncertainty" should always be zero? If the intention is for this code to also at least attempt source extraction in the vicinity of specified position, this should be clarified. Also, "separation from known source" should probably be "separation from closest known source" or "separation from closest detected source", depending on what we want this to be, e.g., separation from the closest known source in the latest LSST static source catalog once one is available, or separation from the closest static source or DIA source found by the LSST pipeline for that specific image. In the latter case, this might depend on the use case, whether one is trying to determine whether a nearby detection might be the targeted object that is farther off its predicted position than expected for some reason (e.g., non-gravs or poor contributing astrometry to the current orbit solution), or if one is trying to determine the likelihood that the forced photometry measurement at a particular position could be contaminated by a nearby source, moving or otherwise. Just wanted to clarify your intention for this parameter... |
Hi @hhsieh00 , I think I was thinking of getting in a measure of how well the newly detected source was measured so something like Dave Tholen's semi-empirical |
@talister, oh, okay, so the forced photometry is actually looking for a source. To me is more like low S/N source extraction, rather than forced photometry which I understand as "forcing" photometry at a specific spot, even if it's blank sky, but that could be fine...that's why I wanted clarification...but also just wanted to confirm that this is what we want. For precovery, I think this makes sense, i.e., if there is a faint source in the uncertainty region that could be the object, that could give you the extra astrometry you want if it's actually the object. This would also probably be the desired functionality for phase function work (although the photometry will be highly uncertain if S/N is so low that it wasn't already picked up by the pipeline). In this case then, I think the output should include both the predicted x/y and measured x/y of the detected source. That said, for outburst detection (e.g., looking for objects that were detected in recent data that should be visible based on simple phase function assumptions at previous pointings where they were not detected, possibly because they were faint at the earlier time, but underwent recent outburst events that pushed them into the detectable range in more recent data), people would probably want to know what the flux is at specific predicted positions (depending on how large the uncertainty region is), regardless of whether there is a source there is not (i.e., to either get photometry of a faint source, if present, or the detection limit if no source is visible at all). Would it be possible to do both? |
I added to two output quantities to better articulate what's desired. This is consistent with discussion on the call. Regarding (x,y) location, is having just the original detector coordinates enough? For the intended use, I would think you also need to know the detector ID. If you don't (or can't) know the detector, I don't think the absolute coordinates tell you anything unless it's in some sort of absolute focal plane coordinate (which wouldn't be in pixels). For the "distance" from the ephemeris output, both quantities I put down are useful, but the sigma measure is much, much more useful. For input quantities, there is an SNR threshold that attempts to pre-filter the output. That's fine. But if this is useful, wouldn't it also be useful to have an optional threshold on sigma "distance" from the ephemeris? As the ellipses flatten out with increasing quality of the fitted orbit, sources in the minor-axis direction will get filtered out much more easily. This approach isn't a rigorously applied in the community as it should be, but maybe this will help. |
Current state of the project(image_photometry branch) 1. Image Service Functionality 2. ImageMetadata dataclass 3. Photometry Service Workflow 4. EndResult dataclass 5. Final output Challenges to Address1. Scalability Issues with Image Service Potential solution1. Performing Local Searches 2. Awaiting SQL Server Enhancements 3. Dividing the Search into Smaller Time Segments I am open to and would greatly appreciate any ideas or methods that could help resolve this issue. |
I tried to follow up on the solutions that came up in the last meeting. Currently you can search for a point within a polygon, but finding the intersection of 2 polygons is not implemented yet on the server. Currently in the process of being realized. |
From the Requirements Doc we have a basic definition of inputs and outputs for the Photometry Service. This issue serves to document these, along with any other additions that are needed, allowing determination of completion of the service.
Overview:
Abstraction of the service to perform low SNR source detection, source measurement and forced photometry at specified locations and return the results to the Controller and the User
Input Parameters:
Output Parameters:
Either:
(Source detection mode)
or:
(Forced photometry mode) table of photometry results containing at least:
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